+- Rawze.com: Rawze's ISX Technical Discussion and more (http://rawze.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Big Truck Technical Discussion... (/forumdisplay.php?fid=1)
+--- Forum: Your Daily Blog (/forumdisplay.php?fid=77)
+--- Thread: Deere aftermarket parts disaster (/showthread.php?tid=10124)
Deere aftermarket parts disaster - mikkhh - 05-13-2025
Little backstory on this parts saga. I bought myself 10 year old telehandler project some time ago. It had a deere tier4 commonrail engine that had some big engine issues. I thought no big deal, looked up usual parts suppliers and almost everything can be had aftermarket for those engines FAST & CHEAP ( I searched by model series and just omitted tier4). Well it had dropped a valve, smashed liner, piston, bent connecting rod, head damaged.
Previous owner had sunken quite a lot of money into the machine in the last few years - new original ECM, new torque converter, all services done at official telehandler dealer, only genuine telehandler brand filters used (not cheap). I had machine picked up at dealer where this thing was written off financially due to repair costs involved. But today this make model year used machine price starts from 40k usd at the used market, dealership pulled the head and then the damage was seen.
Head got repaired at a shop that did machine custom valve seats, since new head was around 3-4k usd (official dealership had a quite steep core charge on NEW part, that is why I was like screw it, going to fix old one). The next issues was piston and liner. Since original pistons have mahle written on them and by just looking parts catalogue by engine number also showed that there is mahle liner + piston available by engine type so I ordered it. Well looked almost same, but piston height and weight was too different, mistake on my part so after all had to order the correct part. Original deere parts cost a fortune, the engine reseal kit was like 3k if I remember correctly and aftermarket known brand version was like 50 something. That is why there is a huge temptation.
While the engine was apart I decided to replace ring gear with deere certified alternative part. The starter motor was replaced by previous owner with mahle part not too long ago. Well on my part I made mistake too - did not verify ring gear and starter gear mesh with the engine off and stater bolted on and just cranking everything by hand. I did check old vs new ring gear on top of each other to make sure that teeth count is the same, well it was and the old starter was working some time before just fine since the starter gear did not look anything suspicious.
I got the engine almost assembled (just missing the final checks after running for some time) and bled the fuel system using deere procedures listed (open main filter bleed valve, pump hand pump until fuel comes, then finger tighten bleed screw and pump until no more resistance felt and close the bleed screw totally) After that I cranked the engine for few minutes at time WITHOUT glow plugs to build up oil pressure and try to bleed the fuel system as much as possible. There was fuel coming to fuel tank return line, had oil pressure.
Well I got too carried out and made a big mistake by not checking rail pressure with scan tool. But still screwed in glow plugs and cranked over engine. 20-30 seconds and clunk was heard like something gave up in the engine. Turned over engine by hand, everything feels okay. Tried to crank again, seemed to crank ok for few seconds and then made some bad noise like starter gear slipping.
Had no other option than to pull the starter and inspect - an hours job, need to support engine from underneath and remove one side engine mount rail, lots of brackets, crank breather assembly. And still starter bolts are still super hard to get.
Here I have attached pictures of what was making the clunk and how good the ring gear looks like. Keep in mind the starter gear and ring gear tooth count and type is correct!
[attachment=9868]
[attachment=9869]
What is the proper thing here to do - NEW starter and NEW ring gear this time original deere part that costs 2.5 times more than their certified alternative (brand owned by themselves). What I am going to do - replace the starter nose cone assembly for sure and then replace the ring gear with deere part. It means engine off and least a day of work.
I have made mistake in the past on 5.9 cummins where I put a wrong starter on it (from benz truck) since original one was nowhere to be found in my area and aftermarket no name china special ones did not last more than few starts before cracking the shaft or starter gear getting stripped. Well that wrong starter gear had too many tooth, when the starter bolts were left loose the engine started and after few months the ring gear and starter gear grinded to a match that worked for couple of years when again starter needed new gear and nose cone bushing. Genuine Bosch starter gear did that, no name china ones maybe managed to start once before those gears started freewheeling or just completely stripped. That saga lasted until ten years until finally pulled engine, replaced ring gear and found out that the starter gear was wrong. Finding bosch starter or just the gear around here is almost impossible so this time aftermarket china brand starter gear has been there working for 1.5 years already.
Keep in mind this is machine that is not making me living, it is just a toy basically, if engine or something fails on it I have a bigger machine with red engine that can lift more than this little telehandler. This small machine should have 5l/h fuel consumption, bigger one has 10-20l/h, but it gets used for 1-2hours per month so no big issue. To put this kind of old telehandler to daily work is not a smart idea because it is old and there are lots of surprises waiting to happen for example hydraulic hoses.
RE: Deere aftermarket parts disaster - Rawze - 05-14-2025
u get what u pay for. after-garbage in = after-garbage failures out.
RE: Deere aftermarket parts disaster - mikkhh - 05-15-2025
Got it apart. Knocked off ring gear with chisel (gear got bent too in the process) and tried metal with file on inside part and tooth part, both were equally soft, unlike the original part that felt hard under file. Looks like that it is not properly hardened or just bad material. Will double check ring gear and starter gear mesh before I install engine. If it moves smooth then I am quite sure that those two parts fit. Starter gear does not have any alarmingly visible damage from this saga. Will check starter shaft for runout.
Installation wise I did not heat the new ring red hot! It was not my first time changing ring gears either.
[attachment=9872]
Friend had 9l deere engine that suffered from 2nd cylinder liner cavitation hole and engine got hydrolocked. That lock happened after lunch break with warm engine. Operator tried to start engine but it was locked up, no visible damage happened to either starter motor or ring gear.
This probably how cheap junk flywheel ring gears are made:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZrWNCCr4MA
That deere approved aftermarket brand has 12months warranty for parts and labour and all associated costs to restoring vehicle back to condition it was in before the damage. Going to see what will happen, are they going to send me just new junk ring gear or refund 50% of ring gear price. Have absolutely no hopes about labour, big job engine off, need to drain fluids, most places will charge like 30-40hours of labour for these things. Contact email form on their website gives error 500. Also on of their other domains gives captcha error related to incorrect domain key.
I looked up some parts from local deere dealer. Injectors, cylinder heads have core charge whether or not the part is reman or not. Really dissapointing this kind of core charge everywhere.