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+--- Thread: CM 871 oil Thermostat temp (/showthread.php?tid=9436)
CM 871 oil Thermostat temp - 2dlb - 02-25-2024
Hi All
im wondering if anyone knows 1.- of the part # for a cooler oil thermostat that is lower that the 235' stat that our CM871 calls for which is pt#4952629.
2. what is the best option for a ecm file based on ISX 450. 79291898 with a CPL 2732 and our current AV10069.13. From the forum i have found Rawzes notes and if im correct could we go with AV10181 or AV10234 as we have changed the DPF to the newer style. I did see that the AV 10183 was higher in torque down lower but as a fleet truck were trying to keep the operating range higher. As well were not in a position to demandate the truck and have to run legite is there a version of the MM that would be good in this or is that only for demandated engines
Thanks in Advance
RE: CM 871 oil Thermostat temp - Rawze - 02-25-2024
NEVER PUT A LOWER TEMP OIL THERMOSTAT IN THAT ENGINE!!!!
If your oil is running too hot then that is a sign of excessive friction in the engine, and is a sign of abuse of some kind. Can be caused by many things including bad/incorrect programming!.
RE: CM 871 oil Thermostat temp - 2dlb - 03-06-2024
Sorry for the late reply. In the fall of 2023 oil analysis was showing an increase in iron. An inspection revealed the valve cam was failing, gear oil was added and the next 2 oil changes showed the deteriation was slowing, as the truck was on a seasonal contract we needed to get to christmas. We are in the process of installing a new cam from Cummins with all new wide based rocker arms. More to the point of the oil thermostat i appreciate the reply but at the risk of being criticized i have to ask WHY! The truck is a 2006 Pete with a 450 ISX CPL2732, 200,000on an inframe with all cummins parts liners at 14', engine was programmed by a highly respected member of the forum, emissions intact, RTO16915 trans which has .79 overdrive however when were loaded we can maintain our 95-100 km in direct down 1 gear and the motors runnin 15-1700 rpm with 3.73rears pulling 135,000lbs all day in hilly country. With 3 of these identical units they all run hot in the summer like 210-215 so my thought was if the oils running at a min 235 and we drop it to 215 with a cummins thermostat its still hot enough to vaporise any condensates in the oil which we run a kleenoil bypass to keep condensates out and try to hold the TAN in the oil down. At 250 degrees of oil were at the limit and we seam to be on the edge of having the oil breakdown. Could this be what has lead to the cam deteriation? We are and have been running Castrol Hypuron semi syn 15w40 with lots of various engines in the 25,000 hr range
Thanks for the advice
RE: CM 871 oil Thermostat temp - Rawze - 03-06-2024
First of all, your problems are obvious!...
The truck is geared WAAY TOO TALL for 135k+ weights. It should have minimum 4.11's .. but more like 4.36's in it for those kinds of weights. This especially so in hilly and mountainous terrain.
NEXT: the engine is a mid-tier. NOTHING IN THAT ENGINE was designed for heavy haul.
The engine was not spec'd for doing what you are trying to do with it .. +++ you are torturing it even more with too tall rear ends~!.
ARE THESE AERO TRUCKS?.. or actual heavy-haul trucks with a large front ends made for the extra cooling needed?.
and then you say its oil system is overheating.. well.. look in the mirror. - you have the wrong equipment for the job!.
A proper tier-1 engine made for heavy haul had a proper DUAL ELEMENT COOLER IN IT. It has a heavy-haul titanium higher-flow turbo on it to help push the heat away. It has a different head and lower compression pistons to lower combustion heat buildup. It has higher-flo injectors in it to prevent injector tip overheating.
I.E.> ITS MADE FOR HEAVY HAUL.. and a mid-tier is NOT!.
If the oil is getting above 240+F so easily, .. assuming any de-mandate programming is NOT causing it for a moment, ... then you are torturing the engine beyond what it was designed for and pushing it too hard. The excessive oil temps are a reflection of this and are your only indicator.
What is the EGT's getting to when the oil temps are getting this high?.
I have seen people haul a lot more heavy stuffs than you describe and not have those kinds of issues unless something was amiss somewhere, or the engine/truck was not built for what your trying to do with it.
That is why you should not put a lower thermostat in it.. it masks all these facts and does nothing whatsoever to help engine longevity compared to simply not torturing a mid-tier CPL2732 to death!.
You also talk about turning up the HP in them... This would NOT be advised on something being tortured. Not unless you just want to tear them up.. especially if the truck has a hired driver in it.... as they tend to not go9ve a s$it but push the fuel pedal all the way to the floor on every single damn hill without any regard to anything.
============
and no.. the flaked out cam was not a result of high oil temps!.
Take your pick...
.. it is a result of either engine abuse (lack of regular overhead valve and other adjustments) ...
... perhaps synthetic oil being used + and/or not changing the oil based on fuel mileage (or often enough vs. its operating loads).
... or crank case pressures building up due to lack of proper crank case ventilation, and it starving the top end of oil.
.. perhaps a combination of the above.
With 135k+ weights .. your fuel mileage is likely in the low 5's.. meaning the oil should be changed at about every 8,000 - 10,000 miles roughly at that point.
ref: http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=8894&pid=76569#pid76569
AND WHEN YOU FOUND THE VALVE CAM FAILING... YOU SHOULD HAVE SHUT TI DOWN RIGHT THEN AND FIXED IT INSTEAD OF HAULING MORE FREIGHT WITH METAL SHAVINGS RUNNING AROUND IN YOUR OIL!.