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DDB

First post here but I’ve been lurking for about a month, trying to get up to speed. I’d like to get some feedback from current owner operators and/or mechanics.

I’ve been out of trucking since late 2009 when I was offered a job in another industry, one that runs counter to the economy. I was very fortunate to make a good living during the recession and the so called jobless recovery. However, now that the economy is booming this particular industry sucks, and I’ve got to find something else (my income this year will be less than half what it was from its peak in 2012).

I flatbedded before under my own authority and loved it, and am looking to do the same now. My budget is around $65k for the truck, and I’d like one with a max of about 400k miles. But I’m flexible on both of these. I’d like a condo and I’d love to find a truck with an APU already installed – not so much for idling comfort, though that’d be nice, but because it would mean that the truck hasn’t been idled much. My understanding is that idling is hard on these emissions trucks.

My #1 goal is to find the truck that will make the most money. My #2 and #3 goals are the same as #1. I’ve downloaded and read Rawze’ pdf book – btw thanks, Rawze, it is excellent information and I salute you for putting this out for free to help others. I have printed out parts of it to take with me when I look at trucks. But before I start that process I need to get things narrowed down a bit. If a salesman senses that you don’t know exactly what you want then he will try to sell you what he wants to get rid of.

Before I found this website I had basically written off anything with a Cummins in it due to the fuel pump and after treatment issues. But Rawze (and others here) have definitely opened my eyes to the benefits of the red engine. I like its open source nature and the ability to do your own maintenance on the emissions stuff (not to mention the demandate option and custom tuning). And, I discovered that one of the best Cummins shops in America is less than an hour from my house (Mr. Haggai). Plus, parts seems to be plentiful and relatively reasonable (probably due in part to the open source specs?). An International with a Cummins seems like the best value. Here’s links to a couple I’m considering (good prices but I think the dealer is kinda sketchy):

http://www.arrowtruck.com/Docs/search.de...kno=227352
http://www.arrowtruck.com/Docs/search.de...kno=226908

Freightliner/Detroit also seems like a solid choice but I’m a skittish about these $10,000 ‘one-box’ emissions systems. I previously drove a 2001 FL Century with a 12.7 Detroit (430 hp, 370 rears, 10 speed) and had no complaints but the fuel mileage was middling, about 6.0 and that was driving at 62. So I’m lukewarm on gliders, even if you could get one. There are some 2014 Columbia gliders not far from here with about 550k miles for $65k. That’s a lot of money for that many miles and my current understanding is that newer emission trucks, even without a demandate, get better mileage than a glider.

Paccar seems to get high marks for fuel mileage and durability, but low marks for parts, software and support. Volvo/Mack are the same, I think. Good products but dealers few and far between and parts proprietary and expensive.

The only thing I’m sure about is to not get a Maxx Force motor. Although, I’ve heard that some of these are going for less than $10k at auction. Seems like a hell of a deal, theoretically, for a donor truck that you could drop a rebuilt 871 into but there must be reasons why no one is doing this.

If I've gotten any of the above wrong, please let me know. All suggestions are welcome. Thanks

hhow55

Gear ratio's on these 2 trucks SUCK. Look for 3.55 or better yet 3.70 with 13 speed. Look's like Chinese tires on drive's, they will only last 100k miles.

DDB

(07-30-2018 )hhow55 Wrote: Gear ratio's on these 2 trucks SUCK. Look for 3.55 or better yet 3.70 with 13 speed.

Thanks, I agree. Its hard to find trucks with these ratios, though. Fleets don't spec 'em like that, for some reason, and 90% of what's for sale are off lease from fleets.

Rawze

You could always go the route of getting something with an 871 in it at auction that needs an inframe. I know that is what i would do. $30k - $40k later (10 - 12 for the truck, 20 for the inframe, less if you do it yourself) and you would have a million mile truck if done right.

Ragindirt

This is the route I am looking at what rawze said. Sold my truck with an 871 but not due to Cummins; needed different tranny, sleeper, and little more realastate for a tag axle.
In the market myself.
Things I've learned here, moving from long nose.

Explosia

I can chime in here as I have recently bought my first truck. I was in your shoes for the last 6 months looking for the right truck. I joined in January and read everything on this site. I knew I wanted an apu for comfort, and low idle time. It is a sellers market and apu trucks are hard to work deals on.

I can tell you this, I will NEVER buy from MHC. I have been in the used car business and know how to recondition cars the right way and the cheap way. And let me tell you I have looked at thier inventory and ran outta there as fast as my feet could go. These dealers are reminiscent of the 70’s sleezy used cars dealers. Lie straight to my face. I found my truck at a place where I never thought I would buy. Lone mountain. I have driven almost 25 years and never been in a corn binder. I really wanted a KW, love the aerodyne.

Most of the trucks from the fleet mine was from were kinda rusty. I went and looked at them, found the truck I wanted. I seen there were deposits on trucks that guys haven’t even looked at. I know because they were rust buckets, with rough interiors. I can’t imagine buying a truck I haven’t even looked at.

I wasn’t allowed to check it out until delivery, which made me walk away. I was hesitant anyways because it was an automatic. I have never driven an auto and said I would never own one. But it was perfect, CLEAN 2015 midroof Prostar, 2350 Cummins 450 with a tri pac and 406k, with 8700 hours and a 5 min idle shutdown 8.1 lifetime mpg. So I kept looking, but in this sellers market trucks were flying out the door. A week or so went by, and that Prostar at lone mountain was still available and I put the down payment on it.

Lone mountain cleans both filters (dpf and doc) and cleans or replaces the doser. Changed all the engine and cab filters, 6 new Goodyear virgins and a 6 mo engine warranty. I called Eaton and the trans has a 750k mile warranty, excluding the clutches. This truck has a 2.64 rear with a 10 speed auto. I asked the Eaton guy to figure my speed at 1500 rpms. He said I would be around 68 mph. Boy he was way off. I don’t want to even elaborate on this because rawze would disapprove lol.

I’m giving you my experience with lone mountain, and by no means am I suggesting that all the trucks they sell are good. I seen plenty of junk on thier lots, I picked out one that worked best for me.

I have to say I am glad I have a Prostar instead of an KW, I love this truck. This is the best designed sleeper I have ever had in all my years trucking. I have driven this automatic for almost two months and I absolutely hate it. I almost taken down a couple of warehouses backing in. If you ever want to make an experienced driver look like a rookie, make him back an auto. If this truck was a 13 it would be perfect. I’m going to visit Mr. Hagg in couple months to complete the finishing touches.

Overall I think I made a good decision, I will have it paid for in 24 months. My only problem so far is I haven’t been able to get insite to install correctly. I’ve been emailing the seller back and forth because it says insite has expired and I need to update when I put the activation key in. If anyone has any suggestions, please send them my way!

Chamberpains

Quote:Posted by Explosia
I have driven this automatic for almost two months and I absolutely hate it. I almost taken down a couple of warehouses backing in. If you ever want to make an experienced driver look like a rookie, make him back an auto.

Made me chuckle cause it's true. I rented 1 for a month and it also liked to up shift in the middle of a turn. I damn near tossed the freight right off the trailer a hand full of times.

As far as your truck search don't be pinned down to dealing with local guys. You have the world wide web at your finger tips and a phone. Search and call. Get information sent to you. Yes salesmen are all sleazy snakes in the grass. But they all want to sell. Which means if you travel 500-1000 miles away to look at a truck then the same thing applies that the guy down the street has trucks and you go down there and look. Have more than 1 truck you wanna look at. Traveling out of your living area can save thousands on purchase price for the exact same vehicle. Spend a couple hundred on travel to save thousands. Truckpaper.com has a lot of listings and doing just a google search can pop up many different things.

I'm currently glancing at the KW t660's. Im not even giving International the time to look at anything newer than my 9400i. I think they are complicated cheap plastic cabs and bodies just like the freightliners have been for years. All prone to fall apart and rattle everywhere. Their chassis's have always been solid but the bodies are just getting crappier and crappier. I know guys will say the same about all trucks but some are clearly not as bad as others. Just look at all the body panels flapping and missing going down the road as certain models get older. Time will always expose weakness in trucks. To me KW's look like they are holding together longer and the older a truck gets the harder it is to find replacement body parts.

DDB

(07-30-2018 )Rawze Wrote: You could always go the route of getting something with an 871 in it at auction that needs an inframe. I know that is what i would do. $30k - $40k later (10 - 12 for the truck, 20 for the inframe, less if you do it yourself) and you would have a million mile truck if done right.

Thanks for responding. A couple of questions though:

1) Are the fuel pump issues confined to the 2250/2350, or do they include the 871?

2) 871 engine is found on 2007-2010 model trucks, and 1/2 of the 2011's -- I think. The key is the 871 has DPF but no DEF tank whereas the 2250/2350 has DEF. Is this correct?

edit - looks like some of the 2007's are gonna have 870's (no DPF)

Ragindirt

Think a will look at a T880 with a sleeper, seem to have more aerodynamics to them then my 800 had. But also with the workhorse mentality.
Problem is everyone I have seen has a Pac in it.