CM871 Oil sample help

[MSPOIRIER]

Good afternoon,

I got some good input in the past here so I wanted to see what the experts think. I have had an intermittent squeak that comes and goes but I have not been able to find it since I bought the truck. We pulled an oil sample and found high Iron and pulled another after 3k miles just to confirm and still high iron. Other then that truck runs fine. Only 141k miles and has 18-20psi idle and 28-35psi 1000rpm+ oil pressure. I am pretty new with oil reports and metallurgy. (I ran an overhead on the valve cam/engine brakes at 132k and cams looked okay) The truck generally averages 40-50 miles per day and 40 miles are usually empty so not a lot of hard work and heat. What could produce a squeak and only high iron with no real other trace metals? 2009 international ISX500V. I usually do all of my work in my shop but due to being so busy I may try to find a shop in MA/New England to take a second look if there are any suggestions? Cummins Northeast? Thank you,

Sam

[Rawze]

That is not high iron.. that is WAAAY THE F$K TOO MUCH IRON!!!>..

At only 8k miles.. that iron level should be single digit!.

That's like spun bearing somewhere kind of high!.

You need to drop the pan and start inspecting things. Something is very wrong somewhere if that iron is not from it sitting and rusting away.

[Nilao]

Yeah my Iron was at 26ppm with 20k on the oil. Something is definitely messed up. You lead and copper were also very high last sample which points to bearing failure.

[MSPOIRIER]

(01-07-2024 )Rawze Wrote:  You need to drop the pan and start inspecting things. Something is very wrong somewhere if that iron is not from it sitting and rusting away.

Yes, My thoughts too. I pulled the second sample because it seemed almost bad sample kind of high, especially with a truck running fine. The second sample seemed to show a drop but still very high. But honestly I cannot rule out the sitting and rusting away part. I bought it a couple years ago with 130k on it. An 09 with 130k in 2020 definitely sat somewhere for a little bit!

Thanks!

[MSPOIRIER]

Well still no conclusive answers yet but due to having a baby last week we outsourced this one to Navistar while we were in the hospital. They pulled the oil pan, pulled main and rod caps as well as inspected the cylinder liners and wrist pins with a scope and said that actually everything looked like it was almost brand new. From the hashing in the cylinder liners to the bearings. They reviewed the samples with me and spent a couple more hours investigating and said the only possibility they can come up with is some thing failed at some point and somebody previously replaced parts and Maybe the iron has not worked out yet. We also replaced the gear fuel pump due to a slight seeping leak but they said everything else looks really good and mechanically in very good shape. I will continue to sample and change oil and filters around the 4k mile mark to make sure the iron is continuing to decrease. Is there any other checks or suggestions anyone can think of? Thanks for your help

Sam

[Aussie Steve]

Your high iron count is not from cams or rockers as there are no elevated nickel levels which indicate hard facing failing. (nickel count should never go above 1 in a healthy engine) Aluminum and silicon together indicate dirt ingress into the intake side although your levels are not abnormal, but you require more samples to establish a trend. Silicon is still elevated but that may be from recent work on the engine. If the sump has been off and it looks ok from the bottom the next place can only be timing gears. Might pay to have a look in there. I had a 3054 Cat engine with iron counts that high but also elevated lead, copper, nickel, aluminum, silicon + others and she had been dusted (bought sight unseen out of an auction yard), Dirt ingress wears everything. Not the case for you.
New engine and new intake pipework solved the problem.
Hopefully I've managed to attach an oil sample to this reply
P.S. - Engines will still appear to run fine to some degree as they self destruct.
  Print Details Oil - Powered By_ InfoTrak.pdf (Size: 145.41 KB / Downloads: 69)

[Aussie Steve]

I've just reread your initial post. Plain bearings can and will make the squaking noise you talk of if they are seizing. maybe your engine has spun a white metal bearing in a timing gear?

[MommaBurt]

i've seen similar samples and people said it was the air compressor. idk how old yours is or anything, just what i've heard.

[MSPOIRIER]

(01-31-2024 )Aussie Steve Wrote:  I've just reread your initial post. Plain bearings can and will make the squaking noise you talk of if they are seizing. maybe your engine has spun a white metal bearing in a timing gear?

Thank you for looking so in depth at this and giving a good response. I think Front cover gears is the only other thing I can think of. I am going to look into quickserve and see what the procedure looks like. I was assured at the dealer that any problems with the gears and it would be more noticeable but I'm not sure either way. As for silicon, it will be a constant battle in my industry operating quite a bit off road but I do pay attention to air filter conditions. I am going to continue to sample to create a trend but maybe It would be smart to sample based on hours and not milage as I average under 50 miles per day? Thanks