cm2350 turbo

[Waterloo]

That motor is more than likely already messed up, especially if you are hitting high EGT numbers. I would get with either Unilever, Mr Hagg or GearHead here on the forum, they all have real shops. If you have Insite maybe something can be done remotely to fix that butcher job in your ECM. Honestly I would not drive that truck until that tune is dealt with. I have been running a tune from here for 3 years now, no complaints, along with hundreds of others. No idea on the X15 liners, a few guys are running them here, and I believe Unilever has worked on one or two in his shop.

[Unilevers]

at 30 psi boost your not running 625hp, i can tell you that.

that motor can be made to do what you want, it just costs money.

-lower compression pistons
-fire ring the head
-cryogenic treated head bolts
-hand torqued head with care taken
-he 551ve VGT turbo
-induction hardened rod and crank
-oil pan girdle
-shim the oil pump up
-better flowing intake
-flow the exhaust better and wrap as much as you can
-a auxiliary fuel pump that has adjustable pressure to flood the high pressure pump
-a good tune

that setup will run 700 wheel HP day in and day out for as long as you want, but as you can see its a serious undertaking if you want it to live. the only real weak spot is the head, which will have to be replaced once in its life.

2350's wont survive well past 600HP under high duty cycles in stock form. they just dont.

[Hammerhead]

See, beer and popcorn...

[Rig Wrench]

From my experience, what you want to do, I would find a cm570,870, or 871 with some miles on it, rebuild it and put it in when the 2350 pops. It's just nota very good platform no matter what. IMO. My 871 is quite a bit stronger than most. And hods up really well. The others bolt in just the same. I wouldn't own anything newer than a 871 to make hp

[Hammerhead]

(08-24-2017 )Unilevers Wrote:  at 30 psi boost your not running 625hp, i can tell you that.

that motor can be made to do what you want, it just costs money.

-lower compression pistons
-fire ring the head
-cryogenic treated head bolts
-hand torqued head with care taken
-he 551ve VGT turbo
-induction hardened rod and crank
-oil pan girdle
-shim the oil pump up
-better flowing intake
-flow the exhaust better and wrap as much as you can
-a auxiliary fuel pump that has adjustable pressure to flood the high pressure pump
-a good tune

that setup will run 700 wheel HP day in and day out for as long as you want, but as you can see its a serious undertaking if you want it to live. the only real weak spot is the head, which will have to be replaced once in its life.

2350's wont survive well past 600HP under high duty cycles in stock form. they just dont.

Ok I'm putting down the beer and popcorn, Uni I have a few questions...

So in a wet liner engine, where are you cutting the fire ring, In the head or the liner?
If your cutting it into the head, where is the ring crushing, the liners top surface or the block deck? Pictures?
Who are you getting to cut these for you?
If it's in the liner, no problem I'll cut them myself in my own lathe.
I built a head centering device to mount Harley heads in my lathe and I cut them for O-ring head gaskets. I have to start with a slightly longer cylinder because you lose the thickness of the head gasket as well the head gets a recess the full diameter of the liner, and the cylinder gets cut below the deck surface so the ductile liner protrudes into the head with .002 interference, and the O-ring groove is cut into the cylinder where the liner ends and the (aluminum for street and steel for racing) begins. Never had a head gasket issue, even when we pushed over 20:1 with nitro.

Where are you getting the rods and crank induction treated, and if your cryo'ing the head bolts, why not the crank and rods as well?

[Unilevers]

go hammer!

the fire ring grooves are cut into the tops of the liners. the factory head gasket has the oem fire rings removed and the crush is measured, i have pics around here somewhere. its a factory head so it takes the place of the oem fire ring just has alot more crush and is made out of sterner stuff. i had stainless counterbore and liner shims made for it aswell. liner height sits at 18 thou. the liners are ductile steel liners in the big one.

the induction treating was done in southern cali. i didnt cryo treat them either because at the first sign of shitting the bed its getting billet rods anyways. i probably shoulda done the crank but meh cant win em all.

my cryo guy in edmonton is top notch. i did the head bolts and torque the head in very small steps and once i get to the factory spec i went another 90 degrees. i wanted to go more but the threads in the block are in shitty spots and i though i would pull some threads upward and distort the crush on the fire rings. holding the gasket is all about how much clamping force you can get and maintain without stretch or heat distortion.

after the head was on it sat for 24 hrs and got checked again. after it was assembled it was checked on the center ones again. and after its first load or 2 it was checked again on the ones i could reach. none have loosened at all.

90+ psi no problems, but this setup has ball bearing compounds.

you can do the fire ringing to a stock truck for maybe a extra 1500 bucks, i would do it if it was mine.

edit - fire rings were done at a custom machine shop in wisconsin. friend of mine he does all the machining stuff for the big diesel pull trucks etc.

[Hammerhead]

Well hot digitty!
I kept a couple of the liners when I had my inframe done, I'm gonna mount up a liner next time I'm at the house and see how they cut. That doesn't look any harder at all to do than what I was doing.
I'll have to dig into the Way Back Time Machine for some pics of when I was doing it.
And don't get me wrong, we had no head gasket problems at 2X:1, but I blew the heads off of it several times. The head bolts couldn't handle the stress, lifted both heads on the first pass. When I cut back to 18:1 I found I could reuse head bolts twice and toss them, they failed 50% after three times so once was safe, twice was only if we didn't have enough spares.
Never tried treating head bolts, now your making me wonder if it would have held with big compression and cryo'd bolts. I went from 3/8 to 7/16 bolts, but there wasn't enough room to go bigger.

[Rig Wrench]

(08-24-2017 )Unilevers Wrote:  at 30 psi boost your not running 625hp, i can tell you that.

that motor can be made to do what you want, it just costs money.

-lower compression pistons
-fire ring the head
-cryogenic treated head bolts
-hand torqued head with care taken
-he 551ve VGT turbo
-induction hardened rod and crank
-oil pan girdle
-shim the oil pump up
-better flowing intake
-flow the exhaust better and wrap as much as you can
-a auxiliary fuel pump that has adjustable pressure to flood the high pressure pump
-a good tune

that setup will run 700 wheel HP day in and day out for as long as you want, but as you can see its a serious undertaking if you want it to live. the only real weak spot is the head, which will have to be replaced once in its life.

2350's wont survive well past 600HP under high duty cycles in stock form. they just dont.

Yep, all that for 700whp, and then have a pump failure and ruin the engine.

[Felonygtp]

You have to plan for failures. Stock trucks fail also. At the moment my plan is to replace the stock turbo with another stock turbo. Fix the tune and wait for the rebuild that im sure is coming. I could rebuild it now but I wanna see what kinda milage i can get with a decent tune. When the rebuild comes the build sheet that unilevers recommends makes more sense. If its getting rebuilt why not lower the compression cryo head bolts and build it right. I dont need 700whp but what seems to work for my company is between 625whp and 650whp. Over that tire wear increases, so does wear on other drive train parts. It gets to the point of not being profitable anymore. Im currently on the other side where there isnt enough profit because im missing loads. If i pulled frieght off the load boards then the current power is prolly fine.
Thank you for the info.