mystery bog

[Brewster64]

I have an 09 cm871 that's continues to annoy me. It has a throttle bog. Has a consistent hesitation for about 1 sec when you accelerate, and many times when coming into a town or onto the ramp it will just bog, almost like the air or fuel is shut off when trying to downshift. Sometimes it will also bog out when getting back on the throttle. A little fluff on the throttle will usually clear it's throat. The truck has been having DOC faceplugged alarms about every 4000 miles which require a code clear, DOC reset and forced regen. The truck is still in stock form as I run CA, and I am just barely holding back doing a tune and modification work. Truck has had ecm, egr valve, cooler, DOC and DPF cleaned, EGR tune up, all new sensors, valve set, injectors pulled, inspected new o rings, new doser, fuel shutoff, ISFM gone through, new solenoid, modulators checked,, and more crap I've forgotten. It's been fun. Every time I do a forced regen my numbers are good, 600 DOC 1050/1075 DPF with .7 or .8 restriction. Truck uses no oil or coolant, mpg is pretty steady 6.5 mpg.. The only wierd thing I just changed was that my program had Regen Disabled on Cruise, it's enabled now. ECM is new and was programmed by local Cummins shop. I would really like to keep the truck legal, but the weekly faceplugged code and drive ability is pissing me off. Any ideas or feedback is appreciated. Thx[/size]

[hhow55]

When mine did this, i had to replace the vehicle speed sensor, and both of the electronic device's on the fuel pedal.

[Vin]

(05-23-2016 )Brewster64 Wrote:  I have an 09 cm871 that's continues to annoy me...ECM is new and was programmed by local Cummins shop. [/size]

I would check to see if your E/C number(Cal) matches(or is compatible with) your CPL number. It is common for the Cummins Dealers to put the wrong Cal in your ECM, often times they think they are doing you a favor by putting a Higher Power Cal in your truck.

Quoted from -Rawze's here http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=1&page=7

"This is one of the biggest mistakes I have seen with mostly non-OEM, but even a few OEM shops out there. There are different types of injectors out there in these engines, and putting say, a 525 HP factory program in a smaller engine will definitely cause it to have the wrong injector offsets. This can lead to a lot of problems down the road, like higher than normal oil temps, improper final Firing Angles (known as Crank Angle), and excess cylinder pressures without really producing very much more power as the engine is running. Also, on the CM870 engines, there are multiple injector and valve cam static timing settings according to actual engine serial number. Putting a different program in may seem ok at first, but can cause some serious problems with the engine in the long term, shortening its lifespan. At the very least, the engine will not run as efficiently as it should, soot and carbon packing set in more easily, and more energy than normal ends up in the oil and radiator, making the engine easier to overheat, etc. The turbocharger will almost always suffer a shorter lifespan form the extra temps too.

- It is simply NOT a good idea whatsoever to put a different program into a CM870 PERIOD without first checking all the thousands of settings for their differences!. This is because of all the different static timing offsets per engine serial number, etc.

CM871 and newer engines are a bit more lenient to timing offsets, as they are all set the same (within each model any ways), but there is still the problem of different size injectors and other components. Some mechanics argue that since many different HP engines of the same model have the same internal hardware, the programs should be compatible, but this is just not true either. The problem comes from the fact that all the hardware of the truck itself, external to the engine, has a huge impact on how an engine runs. It is just as important to compensate for the size of the CAC unit, piping, length of exhaust, diameter, different size/types of DPF, etc. -- AND the fact that some engine compartments have better external air-flow than others, that makes things complicated real fast. There is a very good reason that there are more than 380 DIFFERENT factory programs running around for the CM871 engines alone,.. and this is why!. Many of these different compensations from truck to truck also fall within the same engine CPL rating, so really, there is no way to tell what you are doing by trying a different program unless you look at all the thousands of setting and see what has changed. This is why I cringe so badly what I hear someone come onto the forum here and complain about having issues with their engine, and later they state that they have 550 horsepower in a 485 engine. They have no idea that they are running a program that expects completely different injectors and exhaust piping, it now making a lot more internal efficiency loss at the cost of some cheaply, poorly made power.

Simply put,.. DON'T DO IT! until you have had the different program verified for correctness,.. and you know EXACTLY 100% what changes there are in it so that you know what can be expected."

[hhow55]

Vin,
I read your write up which i think is soooo good.
How do i go about having original file's installed into my truck engine?

[Brewster64]

Thanks for the info. No HP increases here, Stock 485, 1650 program with updates from Actual Cummins Western Canada( and they have NO imagination, or incentive to give a guy mo power) I pull a dry van and am quite content with even 400 HP, Id just like it to run reliably and give me some decent mileage, I really don't care if I get passed on a hill: My power pig days are long gone, lol. I still have this idea in my mind that the VGT is causing both issues, by either sticking or by being sluggish, but the experts say not, and I'm tentative about tossing 4 grand at it to try a new turbo. Ive looked around for a used one cheap, just to try, but no luck. Seems anything out there is a paperweight or new, and Im not really interested in the cheapo rebuilds for half price as I've heard nothing good about them. But, again, Thanks for your input.

[Rawze]

I PM'd you my number.

[Rawze]

I spoke on the phone with him.. He has one of those infamous Duralite CAC units on his truck...

I hate those things! -- And they cause people nothing but grief!...

http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=389

[Vin]

(05-23-2016 )hhow55 Wrote:  Vin,
I read your write up which i think is soooo good.
How do i go about having original file's installed into my truck engine?

You dont need the original Cal (calibration file), but you do need a compatible Cal. Rawze has a list of tested Cal compatibility in the linked page in my previous post. You can update your Cal to Cummins latest version using InCal Disks.

This post really is the best starting place http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=1&page=7

[Unilevers]

(05-23-2016 )Rawze Wrote:  I spoke on the phone with him.. He has one of those infamous Duralite CAC units on his truck...

I hate those things! -- And they cause people nothing but grief!...

http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=389

they strike again!