Cm 870 cry for help

[Rtrucking]

On the cm870 you have to let it run to get all the air out of the system if you do any work on the fuel system. The best way I have found is to let the prime (lift) pump run and press on the comuchuck fitting on the gear pump then start it and let it run it going to stumble for a few minutes then it should run better

[SIDE_SHOW]

(08-02-2019 )Rtrucking Wrote:  On the cm870 you have to let it run to get all the air out of the system if you do any work on the fuel system. The best way I have found is to let the prime (lift) pump run and press on the comuchuck fitting on the gear pump then start it and let it run it going to stumble for a few minutes then it should run better

I let it run for prolly 2 minutes then I shut it off and posted here I went out there earlier and started it back up and it idled fine till I gave it fuel then it started stumbling again at idle as well... I'll let it idle for a few minutes and see what happens thx I appreciate the help

[SIDE_SHOW]

I started it up and let it run for 10 minutes at about the five minute Mark it quit and went to running smooth with just a slight little stumble like it had before and then after that it went back to doing it again but not as bad...was running fine when I started it before I did the actuators just a slight little stumble that I pulled them apart to try to fix

[Lonestar10]

there are so many pockets air can hide then move and cause issues usualy it takes a bit of driving to sort it all out. when i replaced my actuators i did 1 set at a time to make sure it was easy to start as atleast 3 cyls would be good with fuel. ive heard nightmare stories about doing it all at once and taking hours to get started if not using ether as the fuel system had air in it and all the old lines were letting in some air.

another thing is you said theres a whole in EGR and you plugged at intake. that EGR system if hole is past EGR valve can still leak exhaust or if its before valve will still leak so you would be loosing some exhaust pressure that would have created boost.

in the 7.3l diesels when i would do injector o-rings they would run like crap till you took them out on the road beat the hell out of it for 10-15 miles then it would run like a top as it had air in fuel and the hydraulic system that drove the injectors.


so now another problem you have is that tuning. if the engines were different CPLs there are settings in the ECM that normally dont get changed during a tune because they dont need to be but they still effect how it runs and if the guy from facebook didnt put a stock tune for your changed CPL into the engine THEN do the tuning as he most likely just used CT to throw an overlay onto the program and called it good.

your timing could be way advanced which would make a truck seem like its runing like a top while in reality its burning the top of the piston off running way advanced. just like an old car advance the crap out of its gona run super smooth and be snappy but its gona run hot and probably melt pistons.

i dont know the difference in all the parts between CPLs but these are some things i think could happen.

Your metering/timing actuators might be putting to much/little fuel in the selective spots in the injector as the interior spaces in the injector could be different.

the turbo tables might be off due to different ratings of CPLs.

im sure the list goes on.



and for the most part none of us really want to rag on you for your tuning decision. but what we dont want to see is you coming back saying your engine is destroyed and its going to ruin your business/family. the tuning here is time tested over tons of trucks and its free if youll take the time to learn/listen and a small investment. just like coming here you could have your 2250 still going as the dealership brainwash of 1200rpms under a full load and full power is good is such bs on their poorly designed liner system in that type of application.


"maybe you have IDK" one thing i havent seen and most will do it is you asking if anyone is in your area. there might not be but there might be and most people here wouldnt hesitate to stop by with their laptop and software and help pull you out of your rut.

[SIDE_SHOW]

(08-02-2019 )Lonestar10 Wrote:  there are so many pockets air can hide then move and cause issues usualy it takes a bit of driving to sort it all out. when i replaced my actuators i did 1 set at a time to make sure it was easy to start as atleast 3 cyls would be good with fuel. ive heard nightmare stories about doing it all at once and taking hours to get started if not using ether as the fuel system had air in it and all the old lines were letting in some air.

another thing is you said theres a whole in EGR and you plugged at intake. that EGR system if hole is past EGR valve can still leak exhaust or if its before valve will still leak so you would be loosing some exhaust pressure that would have created boost.

in the 7.3l diesels when i would do injector o-rings they would run like crap till you took them out on the road beat the hell out of it for 10-15 miles then it would run like a top as it had air in fuel and the hydraulic system that drove the injectors.


so now another problem you have is that tuning. if the engines were different CPLs there are settings in the ECM that normally dont get changed during a tune because they dont need to be but they still effect how it runs and if the guy from facebook didnt put a stock tune for your changed CPL into the engine THEN do the tuning as he most likely just used CT to throw an overlay onto the program and called it good.

your timing could be way advanced which would make a truck seem like its runing like a top while in reality its burning the top of the piston off running way advanced. just like an old car advance the crap out of its gona run super smooth and be snappy but its gona run hot and probably melt pistons.

i dont know the difference in all the parts between CPLs but these are some things i think could happen.

Your metering/timing actuators might be putting to much/little fuel in the selective spots in the injector as the interior spaces in the injector could be different.

the turbo tables might be off due to different ratings of CPLs.

im sure the list goes on.



and for the most part none of us really want to rag on you for your tuning decision. but what we dont want to see is you coming back saying your engine is destroyed and its going to ruin your business/family. the tuning here is time tested over tons of trucks and its free if youll take the time to learn/listen and a small investment. just like coming here you could have your 2250 still going as the dealership brainwash of 1200rpms under a full load and full power is good is such bs on their poorly designed liner system in that type of application.


"maybe you have IDK" one thing i havent seen and most will do it is you asking if anyone is in your area. there might not be but there might be and most people here wouldnt hesitate to stop by with their laptop and software and help pull you out of your rut.

i just looked up the old esn it was 79201389 CPL 8519 isx 475 the current engine esn is 79188948 CPL 8520 isx 400ST so for sure the cpls were different i just the guy a text to find out if he changed the other cpl settings and he called me up and told me that the everything on the inside of the motor wedges timing and everything is the same im not sure how to check to find that out but i was asking him about the actuators and he told me to unplug one at a time till i find the bad one (RED FLAG) he also told me that if i had a bad one that i took apart and cleaned that it would be worse than it was before idk if thats teu or not... then he proceded to tell me about all the engines hes tuned that are getting 8 plus mpgs which is true i know a few of the guys that run them one has had it in there for 200k and hasnt ever done anything but change the oil its an 870 as well... i did jump the gun for the simple reason that i had sent a few messages about the tuning here and never received a response until uni last night... the guy did tell me that if i wanted to get rid of the tune he did he would flash it back to stock for that esn and cpl but hell i dont know if i even trust him for that now im afraid he might just put the old junk back in it... i guess i wont really know till i get the tune looked at... i know you guys are only talking about the tune because you know that more than likely i got the screws put to me and i know i very well may have... but like i said as soon as get my insite and what not im gonna have one of the guys here look at it and have it redone if nessy in the meantime ill make another thread here to see if there is anyone in the satx area with insite that i could borrow so one of the guys here can take a peak... as far as the 2250 goes ive had that truck a year and it never had any problems all the way to 980k on the odometer that damn thing should be cast in gold lol

[Lonestar10]

definately dont unplug while running the actuators if i remember right something in the ecm logic can cause a permanent derate till the engine is reflashed if i remember right

[Rawze]

Unplugging fueling or timing actuators should never be done as a troubleshooting method.

on unplugging actuators...
http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...3#pid39233
and further info...
http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...5#pid39275

-- You can take apart your actuators all you want to. Just make sure you put them back together the same way they came apart. I have taken many of them apart, and even swapped plungers on them to make good ones out of worn out ones. There is no magic pixies dust that escapes and makes "them run worse" when you open them up. - That statement sounds just like someone would find on that social medai moron site called FB... Hence why I do not participate in such uncontrolled mis-information laden chaos.

[SIDE_SHOW]

(08-02-2019 )Rawze Wrote:  Unplugging fueling or timing actuators should never be done as a troubleshooting method.

on unplugging actuators...
http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...3#pid39233
and further info...
http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...5#pid39275

-- You can take apart your actuators all you want to. Just make sure you put them back together the same way they came apart. I have taken many of them apart, and even swapped plungers on them to make good ones out of worn out ones. There is no magic pixies dust that escapes and makes "them run worse" when you open them up. - That statement sounds just like someone would find on that social medai moron site called FB... Hence why I do not participate in such uncontrolled mis-information laden chaos.

Well i was talking to my dad and he told me that it would run the way I'm describing it and he had to put zipties around the connections to hold them on I'm wondering if that might be the culprit or air in the system... I had to cut the old zipties off to unplug them and I just plugged them back in normal I'll check that in the morning

[Mr Hagg]

I will say this if you had cpl 8519 and current 8520 and using ECM from old engine your biggest problem your facing is camshaft timing. 8519 is 4 degrees on injector cam and 8520 is 6 degrees so if you used a file for the 8519 i could see a real issue.