Time to Inframe?

[Rawze]

I would say for parts alone, usually about 18k or so.

[Waterloo]

(07-26-2020 )david24 Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 )Lonestar10 Wrote:  30 or 40 thousand us. 50 60ish Canadian.

You do labor 25 30k us 35 40 can

Is a brand new isx around 35 or 40k? If so, why not just put a brand new engine in instead of doing an inframe?

I priced out a reman motor my first go around, I was quoted $28,000 US, two months later, that same CM-871, 600hp, still sitting at my Cummins dealer in his back room, went up to $38,000. I can only imagine the cost of a brand new crate motor, that has to be up there in the $50,000 range, if you can even get one.

I am glad I did not go that route, as the quality control on these Cummins motors stinks, they are of the same quality as their reman turbos. Cummins has not been cutting the ledges in the blocks, no shims and tossing the liners in, you have a 100,000 mile motor under the hood if that. You are better off taking the truck to Mr Hagg or doing it yourself. I would not trust a Cummins crate anything in regards to quality, warranty or no warranty.

At this point, a crate motor is a big gamble, unless you are comfortable tearing it apart and machining the block to properly set the liners. If you have to tear down a new crate motor to inspect the liners, you may as well just in frame your motor. Yes you may save on down time, but if it is of the quality I stated above, what have you really saved?

[JimT]

Well, I was gonna do a separate thread and keep this to general information, but doesn't seem to be much other interest here.

So, I just climbed over 570k miles.
My cm2250 burns about 1 gal every 3k. It was 2.5 gal every 10,000 mi prior to de-man, but it jumped to, and has held steady at, 1gal every 3k since March.
It's got blow-by, no question there.
Very little to no coolant lose unless the temps drop around or below freezing, then some random hose always decides to complain.

Well, finally made time to check my overhead and inspect the top end. 14 months and 80k miles since the local mechanic I used to use did it. Seems my gut feeling that I needed to check it myself was right. Here's what I found

#1
Intake was .035
Exhaust was .0365
Jake was about .273

#2
Intake was .032
Exhaust was .030
Jake was .275

#3
Intake was .030
Exhaust was .032
Jake was .271

#4 Intake was .028
Exhaust was .032
Jake was .270

#5
Intake was .032
Exhaust was .032
Jake was .271

#6
Intake was .022
Exhaust was .032
Jake was .270

All valves were then set to correct gaps. The consistency of those measurements makes me think the person who did it last year either used the wrong size feeler or something. The lock nuts were all over the place as far as torque, though none of them were loose.

Even with the valves off like that I was getting between 7.5 and 8.5 mpg depending on load (flatbed), location and conditions.

Everything else inside there looked good... EXCEPT one spot on the cam. #3 Intake lobe looked like it had debris (probably from my fuel pump) go between it and the roller. The surface is pretty damaged on the cam as well as the roller, which still spins normally. Pictures on my phone, will add them later. The rest of the cam looked perfect, barely even a scratch anywhere.

So, knowing what I know now, coupled with the fact that the fuel pump chewed up 2/3 of one of the ceramic plungers about a year and a half ago, I'm guessing that cam lobe has been like that for a while. How safe is it to keep driving this while I start sourcing parts? Would I be risking a large failure? Do I just replace the cam or do a full in-frame? I was hoping to make it to mid-September before doing an in-frame, but I don't want to push my luck any further.

[JimT]

   
   
   
   

[JimT]

   
   
   

Rawze, I don't know if you remember that coolant hose that discouraged us from doing the overhead back in February? Well, as I was pumping coolant out of the tank I realised it was only 4 easy bolts that held the tank in place. Ended up just moving the entire tank out of my way instead of draining any coolant.

[Nilao]

You're on borrowed time with that cam. and all that oil burning I would agree it is inframe time.

[redbeard]

I wish that Mr Hag, Rawze, Uni, or a combination would print a how to manual on preferred ISX tricks and learned ideas to properly rebuild in addition to Quikserve.
They could get some coin and help even more that do not have the ability to get to there place of business.
Engine rebuilding is an art and experience is vital in order to be successful.
I do believe a lot of us could do it with guidance and suggestions from our trusted gurus along with QuickServe .

[Waterloo]

(07-29-2020 )redbeard Wrote:  I wish that Mr Hag, Rawze, Uni, or a combination would print a how to manual on preferred ISX tricks and learned ideas to properly rebuild in addition to Quikserve.
They could get some coin and help even more that do not have the ability to get to there place of business.
Engine rebuilding is an art and experience is vital in order to be successful.
I do believe a lot of us could do it with guidance and suggestions from our trusted gurus along with QuickServe .

I in framed mine using my iPhone and a bag of tools I brought from the house in Rawze's driveway. With his videos and Quickserve it was pretty cut and dry. Rawze helped when I needed two hands and of course when the block ledges were cut. It honestly was not that hard once you actually do one. I would not want to do it again in a driveway, but in a shop, as the weather really buggered us up with a darn near solid month of rain.

And Quickserve spells out the steps in an orderly fashion, with all of the torque specs. When more of a visual is needed, Rawze's video series answers any other questions you might have. I used both.

There are no real tricks to these motors, the reason so many are screwed up by shops is from not following the procedures outlined in Quickserve. When we were taking my motor apart, that was glaringly obvious as to which steps were skipped, or just totally ignored, and there were quite a few. If they would have followed the proper procedures at my "Cummins licensed dealer" on the first in frame, I would not have needed a second.

The proper tools are the set back for most everyone, the tool to cut the block being the major hurdle as that is roughly the same cost as Mr Hagg charges for labor.

[tree98]

Jim, that cam is coming apart little by little every day and releasing metal fragments into your engine. I don't think I would wait to long on the inframe, or atleast change the cam and drop some lower end bearings and check or replace them and get a look at your crank.