2013 ISX 15 rapid sudden coolant consumption

[Rawze]

(05-22-2025 )Nerv Wrote:  Here is #1 and #2 liner they both had 0.032 im guessing oem brass shims. When they were removed both shims were broken. Im guessing this block was never counterbored. Im getting a measurement of 4.688 with a regular depth micrometer, i need to be at 4.752 with a 0.032 shim. That is just using the one that comes with the new liners correct?

here is how it should be done. Anything less and you will not get a million miles out of it...
ref: https://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?...6#pid70606

and as far as the liner heights go...
ref: https://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?...9#pid28349

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Also... those look like the shims that come with new style liners, and not some 'added' shims due to counter-boring. Be sure to verify and double-check your heights.

[Nerv]

So I'm getting 4.688, one or two ledges differ by .001-.002. Im going to use 0.032 shims, so the ledge needs to be counterbored by 6400s of a inch if my math is correct?. The shims that come with the liners aren't used then? They are replaced by the counterbore shims? Or do i need to take into account the liner shims? First time doing the counterboring so want to make sure these measurements are spot on, im going to go over them a bunch more times to be sure its proper measurements, the depth micrometer is new so im hoping its decently accurate. New cummins head is getting ordered soon, im getting a quote of $12k cdn. Should i keep shopping around or is this a normal price for them?. Keep you updated.

[Rawze]

(05-23-2025 )Nerv Wrote:  So I'm getting 4.688, one or two ledges differ by .001-.002. Im going to use 0.032 shims, so the ledge needs to be counterbored by 6400s of a inch if my math is correct?. The shims that come with the liners aren't used then? They are replaced by the counterbore shims? Or do i need to take into account the liner shims? First time doing the counterboring so want to make sure these measurements are spot on, im going to go over them a bunch more times to be sure its proper measurements, the depth micrometer is new so im hoping its decently accurate. New cummins head is getting ordered soon, im getting a quote of $12k cdn. Should i keep shopping around or is this a normal price for them?. Keep you updated.

The OEM replacement liners come with brass shimms on them already. You will need to keep the shimm that comes installed onto them in place .. do not remove them ... and ADD AN ADDITIONAL SHIMM to raise them higher if you counter-bore the block.

I would also heavily suggest going with 0.020 shimms and NOT 0.032 the first time around. using the 0.032 shimms the first time around only serves to have to cut more meat out of the block than necessary, and they should only be used if you have already counter-borred it once before, and need to go deeper yet.

Starting out with 0.032 shimms the first time around IS A BAD IDEA!.

and i don't know where your getting these odd numbers from.. Use the depths that I posted above are what you should be shooting for...
https://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?...9#pid28349

.. and just to let you know... YOU WILL LOOSE 0.001" after the head is installed and fully torqued down when stacking the 2 layers of brass shimms (the ones that come with liners + an added 0.020 shimm). THIS IS NORMAL!, so if you want a true 0.015" final height for a very strong build ... then go with the 0.016" height measurements (in the link above) if you want a final 0.015" height after the head is all locked down, torqued and in place, and has settled, as there will be a bit of 'crush' to them.

[Nerv]

Great I will go for the 0.20 shims, thanks for that info I now got proper measurements. I had the damn micrometer rod in backwards for f##k sakes! Lol.

Im getting an average of 4.725, there is variances across the 4 points on cylinders 1,2,3,4, and 6. Which equal to 0.001,0.002,0.001,0.003,0.001 respectively. Do these differences still need to be cut to ensure an even surface all around? I subtracted the lower from the highest measured points from each cylinder like the manual says to. I am shooting for 0.016, so I need to be at 4.739 with a 0.20 oem shim. So 0.014 needs to be cut to ensure 0.016 protrusion(0.015) when head is torqued properly per your guide.

Let me know if im missing something, appreciate the patience Im doing my best!

[Rawze]

(05-24-2025 )Nerv Wrote:  Great I will go for the 0.20 shims, thanks for that info I now got proper measurements. I had the damn micrometer rod in backwards for f##k sakes! Lol.

Im getting an average of 4.725, there is variances across the 4 points on cylinders 1,2,3,4, and 6. Which equal to 0.001,0.002,0.001,0.003,0.001 respectively. Do these differences still need to be cut to ensure an even surface all around? I subtracted the lower from the highest measured points from each cylinder like the manual says to. I am shooting for 0.016, so I need to be at 4.739 with a 0.20 oem shim. So 0.014 needs to be cut to ensure 0.016 protrusion(0.015) when head is torqued properly per your guide.

Let me know if im missing something, appreciate the patience Im doing my best!

Cummins official spec is slightly higher ( at .004" across the 6 holes, max of 0.002" from adjacent holes), but I have seen issues with this much variance on rebuilds.

For a quality build however ...

The allowance is 0.001" from one side to the other within one hole, hopefully not lower on the exhaust side.

The allowance from one hole to another is 0.002" with a max variance of 0.002" across all 6 holes as well.

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Here is a fine example of the OEM not caring, and me fixing a brand new short-block, it and its done right...
https://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?...1#pid11611