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RE: Excessive regenerations - Mudflap77 - 01-24-2022
(01-24-2022 )Hermjeji Wrote:(01-24-2022 )Mudflap77 Wrote:(01-24-2022 )RollinCoal Wrote: Have you replaced the diff pressure sensor on the filter?It was mentioned to the shop owner that I wanted the dpf delta P sensor changed while they were there. He agreed it would be a good idea. I will have to verify with him that it did get done. Is there another pressure sensor that you are thinking of?
There's a delta P for the EGR and a Delta P for the aftertreatment on the cans.
Aftertreatment is #11
EGR diff is #4
Thank you!!
As mentioned earlier, I'll have to varify that it didn't get missed when they had the DPF out. From what I see there isn't anymore pressure sensors down on the can.
The EGR delta P was changed when the EGR tune-up was done.
RE: Excessive regenerations - tree98 - 01-24-2022
Regen's like that are from massive soot production, where's all the soot coming from? Could be burning oil, have you taken the pipe off from right behind the turbo and checked to see if it's smoking like a freight train? How long did it go without an EGR tuneup?
RE: Excessive regenerations - Mudflap77 - 01-24-2022
(01-24-2022 )tree98 Wrote: Regen's like that are from massive soot production, where's all the soot coming from? Could be burning oil, have you taken the pipe off from right behind the turbo and checked to see if it's smoking like a freight train? How long did it go without an EGR tuneup?
Agreed on whats causing the regens, thats the point of posting here to figure out the problem.
it was starting to burn a little oil. After i got insite and adjusted the parameters allowing me to run higher rpms the little oil consumption was reduced. This first trip after the dpf was cleaned oil consumption is pretty well nothing. I'm going to take a oil sample tomorrow to make sure a injector hasn't picked a well timed moment to fail and dumping fuel into the oil as well as be the cause of the soot, I'm sure this isn't the case but I'm going to verify.
No i haven't pulled the pipe to see if there is smoke as of yet.
I did the EGR tuneup about 77000mi ago myself following Rawze's guidlines. The company I bought the truck from kept great records but they used codes for some of their routine maintenance. So nothing in the records that simple said EGR tuneup. But they did record what they did, like replaced IMAP sensor which was pretty well yearly, clean EGR valve, cleaned 7th injector and so on. DPF were removed and cleaned routinely.. Following their routine the DPF would have been due to be cleaned in late spring which was my plan.
Thank you for your reply!!
RE: Excessive regenerations - Hermjeji - 01-24-2022
(01-24-2022 )Mudflap77 Wrote:(01-24-2022 )tree98 Wrote: Regen's like that are from massive soot production, where's all the soot coming from? Could be burning oil, have you taken the pipe off from right behind the turbo and checked to see if it's smoking like a freight train? How long did it go without an EGR tuneup?
Agreed on whats causing the regens, thats the point of posting here to figure out the problem.
it was starting to burn a little oil. After i got insite and adjusted the parameters allowing me to run higher rpms the little oil consumption was reduced. This first trip after the dpf was cleaned oil consumption is pretty well nothing. I'm going to take a oil sample tomorrow to make sure a injector hasn't picked a well timed moment to fail and dumping fuel into the oil as well as be the cause of the soot, I'm sure this isn't the case but I'm going to verify.
No i haven't pulled the pipe to see if there is smoke as of yet.
I did the EGR tuneup about 77000mi ago myself following Rawze's guidlines. The company I bought the truck from kept great records but they used codes for some of their routine maintenance. So nothing in the records that simple said EGR tuneup. But they did record what they did, like replaced IMAP sensor which was pretty well yearly, clean EGR valve, cleaned 7th injector and so on. DPF were removed and cleaned routinely.. Following their routine the DPF would have been due to be cleaned in late spring which was my plan.
Thank you for your reply!!
I would think a fuel pressure leakdown test would tell you an easy yes or no in terms of the possibility of injector leaking. If the test comes back with good pressure retention, then you probably don't have a leaking injector?
RE: Excessive regenerations - Colter - 01-24-2022
Please don't just blindly swap sensors, its too expensive to just guess.
The probability that your actual cooler is leaking is much higher then a boot, you can make a rough
tester from PVC although an actual test tool kit will be the same price as one or two sensors.
You can use Insite to check fuel rail leakage, this may fail even without a 0559 code active/inactive but the code will have your fuel system troubleshooting. Even if your out of spec I would still put more weight on air or lack thereof being a more prevalent issue.
RE: Excessive regenerations - DieselKid - 01-25-2022
(01-24-2022 )tree98 Wrote: Regen's like that are from massive soot production, where's all the soot coming from? Could be burning oil, have you taken the pipe off from right behind the turbo and checked to see if it's smoking like a freight train? How long did it go without an EGR tuneup?
Agreed, a snap test would be a good start to determining if any other factors are causing excessive soot/particulate production
RE: Excessive regenerations - Mudflap77 - 01-25-2022
(01-24-2022 )Colter Wrote: Please don't just blindly swap sensors, its too expensive to just guess.
The probability that your actual cooler is leaking is much higher then a boot, you can make a rough
tester from PVC although an actual test tool kit will be the same price as one or two sensors.
You can use Insite to check fuel rail leakage, this may fail even without a 0559 code active/inactive but the code will have your fuel system troubleshooting. Even if your out of spec I would still put more weight on air or lack thereof being a more prevalent issue.
I agree with you to a point, I'm not one to blindly throw parts around without a thought process behind it. Sensors can fail in range and not throw a code. When I had the sensor fail last summer the truck was sounding a bit odd that morning making noises I now relate to the EGR. still ran fine, then the sensor completely failed at 3:30 pm saturday afternoon on the july 4th weekend in Aberdeen SD 2.5 days down and a late delivery for a $160 sensor. Now when talking about the Nox sensor @ $880 if it wasn't showing not stable reading and no codes but also there is the fact it is original as far as I know and has been sniffing exhaust for about 18,000hrs. Also being on a 2 week turn around schedule with only 2 or 3 days home to figure some of these problems out at some point you just say F-it change them all. LOL
The boots @ $35/pcs are a wear item in my mind they will leave you dead on the road climbing a 11% grade when they blow. As mentioned earlier I replaced a leaking clamp already. I have a CAC test kit and tested the CAC back in Sept. I usually test it about every six months.
I dont thinks its fuel related either but a want to cover all angles. Sooner do extra work at home then have problems out on the road..
RE: Excessive regenerations - Rawze - 01-25-2022
If the DOC and DPF are getting face plugged prematurely then they need to be removed.. pictures taken of their faces .. and what is plugging them needs to be determined. - Is it soot on their faces?.. is is dried coolant?... oil intrusion from bad valve guide seals?.. is fuel seeping out of the Doser injector because it has gotten leaky?... etc.etc. and then go from there... or when you pull them off,.. if they are not bad, and the system is crying wolf?
- you can guess at things till your blue in the face... but determining the cause, and how bad it is. is the first step.. always.
If you end up pulling them apart again, then take pics.. post them on here.. it will help determine what the buildup may be on them.
RE: Excessive regenerations - schISM - 01-25-2022
One thing that I noticed on the screenshot you posted was your beginning DOC inlet temp. on your second to last regen attempt was at 699 degrees. At 700 degrees for more than 60 seconds the ecm will abort a passive regen, but it should have thrown a code for DOC overtemp. and you never mentioned anything of the sort. This is just a suggestion you might try, turn your regen permit switch in the dash to “off” and wait till you know you can be steady interstate driving for 50 minutes or longer. Go to data logging in INSITE and bring up the DPF monitoring parameters. Make sure the DPF status is either SCR warmup or inactive before you enable the dash switch and pay close attention to the DOC inlet, DPF inlet and DPF outlet temps after the DPF status goes to active for a passive regen. DO NOT let the DOC inlet temp go to more than about 680, the DPF inlet more than 1100 and the outlet much past 1200. That might mean gearing down and only running 55. Keep an eye on the soot load also, it should go to zero about 35 minutes into the regen. If all is well at the 45 minute mark the regen should complete and all should be good for another hundred engine hours. If it never completes or your unable to keep the temps in check it’s gonna ask for another regen in a few hours. Now if your unable to get a passive regen out of it I’d say the issue lies in the aftertreatment system itself...face plugged DOC/DPF, delta P sensor or feed tubes need to be replaced ect....If you can get a completed regen out of it try running a few days with the regen permit switch in the off position. If the system allows it for more than a few days without a DPF full error then I would start looking at the EGR system for the problem. Make sure the EGR delta P orifice ports are clean and the exhaust back pressure port in the thermostat housing is clean as well. If I had to guess what the issue is though based on the hours of the engine I’d say your EGR cooler is about plugged up with carbon resulting in higher than normal exhaust back pressure causing the ECM to command more EGR to overcome the obstruction, closing the VGT turbo to force more exhaust through the EGR valve and triggering the ECM into asking for a regen to clear the “soot” it thinks is blocking the DOC/DPF.
Pheeeeew....I apologize if I got a little long winded there but if there’s something I didn’t clarify correctly or completely please ask and I’ll do my best to keep it short. Good luck.