Algae or asphaltine?

[Rawze]

(07-26-2017 )Vjex Wrote:  Very helpfull, thank you very much!!!

Another problem is that I see a lot of guys run around with mostly empty tanks. Owner-operators who only put in just enough fuel into the tanks to get them where they are going to try to save money on fuel instead of keeping them topped off.

Guess what ..

IT DOES NOT SAVE YOU MONEY!

This is because those low tanks are always building up moisture and that moisture is always making a nice place for algea to grow and screw up your fuel system long term.


Every time your windshield fogs up -- so does the inside of your fuel tanks if they are low!

[Brock]

If you go on the davco website it tells you to not even worry if your filter is black.

[Vjex]

(07-26-2017 )Rawze Wrote:  Another problem is that I see a lot of guys run around with mostly empty tanks. Owner-operators who only put
...

Thanks for the tip!
Since your opinion is very well respected, what is your take on quality of Pilot/Flying J diesel? Is it as bad as Waterloo says?

Thanks

[Nilao]

My opinion is diesel is diesel. Now what they add to it is the issue. My understanding is pilot uses animal based bio's to make their bio diesel. The tanker driver is the one who mixes the blend at the time he dumps his load so depending on the driver your blend could be weak or strong. That's why,if you look at their app it says intended bio blend %.

I'm not sure how the others get their bio from. But I know TA/petro adds a anti foaming agent to their fuel as well as a couple performance additives for cleaning, etc.

My take on it is I avoid pilot flying j due to my principles, not their fuel quality. How many times have pilot management been sued for not giving the promised rebates. If they're willing to steal from your rebates, what else are they taking from you.

[Rawze]

(07-27-2017 )Vjex Wrote:  Thanks for the tip!
Since your opinion is very well respected, what is your take on quality of Pilot/Flying J diesel? Is it as bad as Waterloo says?

Thanks

I take all of it with a grain of salt.

I asked that very same question once to the fuel department where I am leased onto. They switched from mostly pilots to mostly TA/Petro a couple years back. They do use both though. They also only let their company drivers (most of the fleet) fuel in certain places and areas and not others according to a fuel guide. They have more than 2,000 trucks in their fleet and I thought it rather odd that they use both, yet only let drivers fuel only in certian places and not just any TA/Petro. ... This is the response I got, they are not my words...

"Good or Bad fuel is everywhere. We found out that the supply trucks for each of the truck-stop chains all go to the same exact whole-seller tank farm supply in a given area. We are set up with all the major truck-stop chains and some smaller ones to pay only raw whole-sale price + a percentage (I think it was like 5% or something really low) and not the pump price at all. This dictates that for all truck-stop chains in a given area, we get the same price. If you look in the fuel guide, and then consider what whole-seller is supplying what truck-stops, you will see that on one side of a state, we allow fueling all over a particular region, and in another part of a state, we do not. Some wholesalers cover a very wide region and some do not. This is why we allow a lot of places to get fuel all grouped in one area and other areas there are no places they can fuel. The only exception is Oregon, California, and Indiana where fuel taxes cost more than the fuel discounts. In those states we chose only a very few places key to getting you out of that state or for emergency fuel only. In the guide, it says 50-gallons fill-up max for those states. We looked into fuel quality and found out that all the major truck stops are pouring the fuel into the tanks at the truck stops right from the same wholesale tanks at the supplier. They add nothing nor take anything away. Their trucks do not have secondary tanks with added chemicals to mix by and their advertising is all gimmick. It costs them extra money to mix fuel and adds independent risk of fuel related truck problems they can be sued for if they alter the fuel. Therefore they solely leave the risk at the hands of the bulk supplier, who does not care who buys what fuel from them at all. The suppliers buy in bulk to their wholesalers and refineries. Some refineries are better than others, and that is why in some areas the fuel downright sucks and other places it is of good quality. it is also why bio-fuel mixes are the same percentage by area and region and not by an independent truck stop. The exception would be an independent truck stop that does not use a particular regional supplier but they are rare. You find bad quality fuel somewhere at a major truck stop then you can be assured that all the surrounding truck stop chains by that supplier have bad fuel too. Don't forget though, that places like Salt Lake city, for example, on the east side of town, there is one wholesaler, to the north, another, and on the west side of town, they all use a different, cheaper wholesaler out of Nevada. this is also why price on one side of town is very different than the other for us, although the pump prices are competitive. There are a few wholesalers we try to avoid because of quality issues and have filed complaints, then since boy-cotted them, but they are only a very few. The one that supplies the east side of Salt Lake City is one of them. We only allow fueling in the most northern part of the state (supplied by a wholesaler in idaho) and to the west of Salt Lake because of this."

I then asked them why the move to TA/Petro instead of Pilot if they were getting the same fuel at the same prices? -- they said...

"Because we found that truck-stops with fuel tanks above ground are more prone to large temperature fluctuations and prone to moisture in the fuel and problems with volume accuracy at the pumps. TA/Petro stations have a much higher percentage of under-ground or protected tanks and therefore less error at the pump. Also because it was a request of the drivers who would rather fuel at the larger size truck stops with better amenities where there is less chance of a parking accident because they typically have more room between spaces to park. We also do not allow our trucks to fuel at smaller independent truck stops because of lack of getting wholesale price + percentage, but also because the less fuel a truck-stop sells, the more algea and other issues we like to call "stale fuel issues" that we have seen by them. It is the truck stops selling in large volume that have the least problems with fuel at the pumps. We also encourage drivers to feel the fuel nozzle and see if it is extremely cold or hot as it comes out. This is one of the biggest pump volume discrepancies we have seen by the pilot/flying-J truck stops and this is why we have stopped using them as much out west. Many of them have tanks above ground and in the western states and the fuel gets so hot you can barely touch it. 100 gallons suddenly becomes 140 gallons of volume by the time you fill up two 100 gallon tanks."

======

Those are not my words, but someone else's. I thought it had some merit and have not seen evidence to think it was false what they said. I.E. -- I let others figure that out for themselves. As an owner operator, I can fuel anywhere I like and do not have to follow their guide at all. They do not mark up fuel prices, I pay what they pay. Because of this, it is not worth it to me to deviate form their company driver guide because that large discount goes away whenever I do.

[Nilao]

I disagree with the mixing of the fuel at the station. I have seen the bio tanks they use to add it to the fuel. Asked a tanker driver what was in the shed and he told me that's the straight bio he mixes with the fuel. This was at a pilot location in Arizona.

[smorgan87]

I used killem. About 1.5 times recommended shock treatment in brimming full tanks. Ran it from the fuel station home (2 miles) and sat it all weekend. Im past due another treatment but my filters last 3 times longer after the treatment. I fuel up at the small station at home or at loves. Use a buddys showers since he always makes diamond.

[Old Driver]

I haul fuel locally in the MN/WI area. All the truck stops get their fuel from mainly one supplier, dosent matter if it pilot/ flying j or TA or more independent smaller truck stop. There is a difference from state to state on the bio. Most of the truck stops like to all use one supplier around here but when the price is right they'll get it from anyone. When people talk about TA being better or pilot fuel being crappier it's kinda a joke because it is the exact same diesel pulled on the same codes. One might add a winter additive but that's seasonal. Here the tanks are all underground.