Turbo boosting at idle?

[Candycane]

New here fellas need help mechanic is stumped 2018 pete with 565 performance series x15 i have boost at idle around 3psi rev it up shoots up also put on new intake sensor/boost sensor and now turbo and actuator truck was mandated at the time but is now de mandated and still does this has about 485k on it iam lost already got alot of money into this and down time thank god i got a spare truck

[Rawze]

(08-22-2021 )Candycane Wrote:  New here fellas need help mechanic is stumped 2018 pete with 565 performance series x15 i have boost at idle around 3psi rev it up shoots up also put on new intake sensor/boost sensor and now turbo and actuator truck was mandated at the time but is now de mandated and still does this has about 485k on it iam lost already got alot of money into this and down time thank god i got a spare truck

FIRST AND FOREMOST: you can start by assuming that your de-mandate program to be bad. That is the big elephant in the room that will severely shorten that engine life if it is not 100% correct... despite what the person who shoved it into your engine would tell you.

NEXT: what you describe so far is that the engine is most likely operating in the wrong engine operating mode. Rapid warm-up mode is designed to make extra boost at idle to heat up the SCR/DPF system. That is what they do from the factory (although it can get too aggressive with bad sensor feed-back)... and that is what it will continue to do after some a-hole of a rip--off shop typical bad delete "tuner" idiot puts in one of those half-arssed delete programs into the ECM that they most likely got off the internet for free, and then charged you a few thousands of $$$ for it, mostly just ripping you off, exploiting you for all you are worth.


(all model ISX's newer than a CM870 /year 2006 models)...
The reason that the X15 engine from the factory makes a lot of excess boost after it is cranked up is that it is putting an internal load on the engine to make a lot of extra exhaust heat. This is to warm up the exhaust system components as fast as it can so that they will meet EPA requirements. This happens a few seconds after the truck starts, engine changes sound very slightly and turbo ramps up at idle. ... FROM THE FACTORY, IT IS SUPPOSED TO DO THIS UNTIL THE DPF/DOC/SRC SYSTEMS ARE AT 550-F DEGREES (because a cold emissions system will not pass EPA requirements), then it changes engine operating modes again and starts to relax. <- it is called "Rapid engine warm-up" operating mode. That is what the ISX engine does.

The engine rapid exhaust warm-up mode(s) can get also too aggressive if the engine gets the wrong sensor feed-back data.. and it can be solved fairly easily, usually by way of an EGR-tune-up and ensuring that the egr flow, engine, and other temp sensors are reading correctly... and that the EGR piping and EGR cooler is not restrictive / not full of soot.

A BAD DELETE PROGRAM HOWEVER will not change this situation, as more than 99% of all delete program out there are horrible because the idiot who made it knows nothing about engine mode control, and therefore never re-programmed the engine to STOP USING THIS DPF WARM-UP MODE.. because in their own stupidity and ignorance.. they always try to "leave everything as factory as possible".

How Most of these so-called "delete" programs are made is that someone unplugs all the stuff they want gone.. they block all the fault coeds that happen from showing up in the dash of the vehicle like a complete moron... and they try like hell to leave everything else as factory-set as possible.. THIS LEAVES THE ENGINE IN A VERY BAD STATE OF CONFUSION AND IT IN THE WRONG OPERATING MODES, AND IT DESTROYS ITSELF AND/OR ITS TURBO REPEATEDLY EVERY FEW YEARS OR SO ... ALL WHILE THE TRUCK OWNER BRAGS ABOUT HOW "GOOD" IT SEEMS TO RUN.

I.E>> The fact that some moron may have shoved a delete program means nothing unless you have it inspected to see if it was done correctly (more than 99% ore NOT done correctly because they come straight from those auto-tuning web-sites where bad information runs rampid). Bad delete program, the ECM DOES NOT CANCEL THIS DPF warm-up MODE CONTROL because most all bad delete programs, all the idiot who made the program.. all they did was unplug a bunch of s$it, block the fault codes from showing up in the dash of the vehicle to makt the truck owner happy,... and the engine internally is still screaming for all the stuff to be in place. ... THE RESULT IS THAT THE ENGINE WILL STILL CONTINUE TO TRY TO WARM UP THAT DPF CAN THAT IS NOW HOLLOW AND IT CANNOT EVEN SEE IT ANY MORE ... GETTING IT PERMANENTLY STUCK IN THESE EXCESS BOOST AND HORRIBLE WARM-UP MODE(s) FOREVER... CAUSING A SEVERELY SHORTENED ENGINE LIFE!... EVENTUALLY DESTROYING ONE OR MORE OF THE HEAD, LINERS AFTER A COUPLE THREE YEARS, ETC. -- THAT IS ITS FATE IF YOU DON'T GET THAT PROGRAM EXAMINED RIGHT THE HE$LL AWAY!.. TO SEE WHAT YOU GOT IN THERE!.

BTW: There is about 200 people a year that come on here and have similar problems.. It is a plague of bad programming in the trucking industry all in the name of "getting rid of that DPF"... and a plague of destroyed engines, fretted liners, wiped out cams, cracked pistons, and all the other stuff that follows, to go right along with it. BAD Sh$it delete programs and the crooks that put them into truck owners engines has spread worse than the ku%ng-flu-coof in the trucking world. Those big-name companies are the worst offenders and all the smaller shops follow their bad programming.

THAT ENGINE SHOULD NOT BE ramping up that turbo at idle any more and going into DPF/SCR warm-up modes if that DPF + SCR cans have been all hollowed out properly because it was de-mandated.

your mechanic is not going to have a single clue as to what is going on... they likely don't even know that the ISX has multiple operating modes.. nonetheless what damn mode it is in when it is making the excess boost at idle. - That is the sad state of our trucking world and how utterly clueless those mechanics are because they are all kept in the dark about how these engines really run.

AND the fact that you said it is making too much boost at idle BEFORE and AFTER the delete (regardless of what the issue it really was) points directly to a bad delete program!.

The FIRST STEP is have the program in you ECM examined to see what engine operating modes are still active in it. Ensuring the engine is in the right operating modes (its factory non-egr operating mode if it is deleted) by way of checking the program and looking to see what the ECM is doing properly (the likely getting any half-baked bad wannabe delete out of that ECM and a properly made program in it in stead if needed).

After ensuruing the engine is in the correct operating modes and the programming is good ... Going thru the engine PROPERLY and solving the original problem of why it wanted the turbo to ramp so hard at idle (or other issues it may have had) instead of blind-damn-gusessing ... to ensure that the entire the engine is running its best. This is done by proper tune-up work, performing the any proper tests like CAC/intake leak tests, injector leak tests, turbo and other inspections, etc.. and all the other stuff that will solve any issues it may have had that your mechanic is most not finding.

THE NEXT STEP would be to find out exactly what hardware changed/mods were made to the emissions and egr systems... MANY SHOPS any more do not properly deal with these emissions systems correctly and that in itself creates problems later on all on their own.

Fight one battle at a time.. not 3 simultaneously, and things go a lot smoother.

1). COPY the program out of that ECM and e-mail it to me for review. I will tell you what someone did, if the engine is going to operate in the correct operating modes, and if that program is harmful too... That is the very first move you should make towards solving it if you give a damn at all about your equipment.

2). FIND OUT EXACLTY what hardware changes were made and if they were all done correctly. Many shops do not do this stuff 100% correctly and it compounds the issues later on.

3). Go thru the intake and engine, perform all the necessary tune-up work and tests to ensure the engine is healthy instead of blind-man guessing at all of it and wondering why you can't find whats causing issues.


I PM'd you my number.

[Candycane]

Thank you rawze i will call you and explain the situation a bit better my rig is up in canada getting worked on and with this covid shi#t i cant be with the truck and i want it fixed before i need it this fall this is very frustrating and iam picky on my trucks thanks man

[Rawze]

(08-22-2021 )Candycane Wrote:  Thank you rawze i will call you and explain the situation a bit better my rig is up in canada getting worked on and with this covid shi#t i cant be with the truck and i want it fixed before i need it this fall this is very frustrating and iam picky on my trucks thanks man

those delete and repair shops in canada are the worst on the planet for bad delete programming.. the very worst places of them all. BAD DELETES are a plague of epic proportions up there and they all blame the engines for being weak after they put all their tear-up-your-enigne garbage programs in them.

[Candycane]

Oh thats just great...... now i really dont know what to do should i even have them mess with it and bring it back down to the states iam in nd truck is 20 miles away into Manitoba

[Rawze]

(08-22-2021 )Candycane Wrote:  Oh thats just great...... now i really dont know what to do should i even have them mess with it and bring it back down to the states iam in nd truck is 20 miles away into Manitoba

my suggestion is that you get the stuff to pull the program out of that ECM it yourself.. that is the place you should start... STOP RELYING ON OTHER PEOPLE TO DO WHAT YOU CAN LEARN TO DO!... a damn adapter off flea-bay is only $300 bucks or so and the software is all over the interwebs for free if ya just look for it!.

A cheap laptop and an adapter is a MUST HAVE for any ISX truck owner any ways... otherwise your at the mercy of the over-priced repair shops every time there is a tiny hiccup of any sort. That is no way to run a trucking business!.

BESIDES THAT... what the heck are you going to do if you ever have to replace that ECM?.. you going to pay the idiot all over again if the program ever has to be re-flashed?--- GET A COPY OF THAT PROGRAM INTO YOUR OWN HANDS AND STOP BEING A VICTIM OF OTHERS WHO ONLY WANT TO RAPE YOUR WALLET EVERY TIME YOU SNEEZE!.

and WHY can' your mechanic pull the program out of the ecm and e-mail it to me... what is wrong with them doing this?... are they not trained in how to do a basic back-up and restore of an ECM program.. in case the ECM needs replacing?

If your mechanic is not trained on how to do this.. have them call me.. I don't mind answering questions as long as they don't start getting arrogant, and are willing to learn.

[Rawze]

This is the screen you (or your mechanic) should be watching to see what that engine was doing.. both before and after that delete occurred. It reveals engine mode, injection timing, turbo position, and most all the other top-most important stuff on what is going on with the engine...


(right click and choose "View Image" for a larger view).

[Rawze]

Opening someone's eyes to what the issue really is .. is usually the first step in solving anything.

[Candycane]

The mechanic is a good dude hes my go to guy with my older stuff the other go to is over 250 miles away that has more knowledge with this newer stuff dont think we will have trouble getting this figured out if ur willing to help them out that would be great ill make it right with you also iam new to this motor iam used to the non computer stuff i much appreciate everything so far will get in touch tomorrow! The place i got the truck dont do the deleted stuff they send it to my other guy but with covid they wont let me bring it across they have to come get it then they bring it to my other guy its alot of screwing around i know