New(to me) truck with unknown tuning.

[mattdm]

Recently picked up a 2013 Pete 367 with the ISX 550hp at the auction and am working on getting it cleaned up and into service. Its had a few parts removed and was tuned at some point. It doesn't feel like its running as smoothly as it should(most noticeable under load/on grade), there was a stored fault when I purchased it for Mechanical timing, but it was cleared over 500km ago and has not returned. I purchased the timing tools with the plan to investigate that, but after reading about bad tunes and fuel timing I thought i should start with that. Recently been learning all about Calterm and insite and was able to pull the file out. Wondering if someone would look at it and let me know what ive got. Thanks!

[Rawze]

(07-17-2023 )mattdm Wrote:  Recently picked up a 2013 Pete 367 with the ISX 550hp at the auction and am working on getting it cleaned up and into service. Its had a few parts removed and was tuned at some point. It doesn't feel like its running as smoothly as it should(most noticeable under load/on grade), there was a stored fault when I purchased it for Mechanical timing, but it was cleared over 500km ago and has not returned. I purchased the timing tools with the plan to investigate that, but after reading about bad tunes and fuel timing I thought i should start with that. Recently been learning all about Calterm and insite and was able to pull the file out. Wondering if someone would look at it and let me know what ive got. Thanks!

Copy the file out and e-mail it to me for a proper review of what someone did in there. In the mean time, assume it is bad, as more than 90% of all demandate and/or custom programming is extremely harmful to the engine internally. This even before anyone adds any power to it.

maybe this info helps too...
ref: http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...5#pid72945

[mattdm]

That is my fear. I don't need a hot boy tune in this truck, especially if its going to end up costing me in the end.

[Rawze]

Here is what I see in the file that you just sent me...


** This program (and engine ser#) is for is a CM2250 engine. It is not as common to see a 2013 model truck that came factory with with a CM2250 engine in it, ... but they are out there.

(program is significantly out of date) ...
== The program is very old (by many years) and contains known bugs that have since been fixed by the engine maker. What really needs to happen is that the ecm needs to be properly updated with the latest factory software (2020 or newer), vehicle settings restored, run for 10 minutes, and then the file made up again.

--- Aside from that ...
Looks like another one of those Canadian-made, garbage, engine killing ripp-off programs for the masses ...


--------
(NO engine operating mode control re-mapping has been done) ...
== Improper engine operating mode control re-mapping (or none at all) is one of the most common issues with bad delete programming. This also causes the biggest problems of all, as the operating mode control logic tree is hard-coded to create as much internal engine friction as it can + choke the exhaust all the time (using the turbo, over-spooling it) to warm up the now missing cans under the truck... but this condition can never be satisfied, causing the engine to perpetually be in this state... eating turbochargers up, beating liners out of the engine block, and all sorts of disastrous results, the severity depending on how hard the engine is worked.

That ecm has no kind of A.I. or any other kind of fairy fart dust fix-it sauce inside it. It is dumb as a brick, and once it simply sees zero degrees (or no feedback at all) from the emissions systems, blindly assumes they are not up to temperature, and the engine operating mode control gets stuck like this permanently. It slowly eating the guts out of the enigne (dropped liner, accelerated ring wear, accelerated wrist pin wear, turbo over-spooling and damaging itself, etc) going down the roads.

Here is an overview of the different engine operating modes found inside the ecm ...
ref: http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...0#pid16780

--------
(EGR request and assumption logic is all still in place) ...
No one bothered to correct the injection timing, fuel-air mix, or anything else for the engine to run without harming itself internally without EGR gas. The valve itself may have been disabled, but this has no effect on the ecm's demands or assumptions for EGR on the system. This is harmful and contributes heavily towards progressive damage over time to both the engine and the turbocharger. Another typical bad-delete mistake that is commonly seen.


--------
( The injection timing has been edited and is now significantly harmful) ...
== In many bad delete programs that I see every year, the injection timing is not edited at all. This is extremely harmful to the engine once that EGR gas is taken away from the intake. This is one of the most common misconceptions that these clowns that do these delete files have out there. somehow they have convinced themselves that the factory injection timing is not going to be harmful.. but they are dead wrong!.

Too far advanced injection timing is the fast track to beating a liner out of the engine block. It also causes accelerated valve seat wear, fuel impingement problems in common rail engines, and can lead to a hole burned right thru a piston. As soon as someone takes away that EGR gas.. the engines injection timing is TOO FAR ADVANCED across the entire spectrum. Not by a little.. but by a lot!. That ecm is dumb as a brick and has no magical fix-it sauce to correct this at all.

-- IN YOUR PROGRAM... someone has added insult to injury on it, compounding the problem greatly. Someone ADDED EVER MORE injection timing by several degrees + they used the very damaging A1 injection timing table meant for use of heavy EGR gas, copying it to other engine operating modes as well. this is well known to cause accelerated valve seat wear and fuel impingement problems... leading again.. to progressive engine damage over time.


( The Power/torque curve has been completely destroyed) ...
You have exactly the same engine killing, kindergarten torque curve as this guy did.. literally .. as shown in this post. maybe the same clueless fool who created that program made yours too?. - sad indeed.
ref: http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...7#pid69717

This is beyond some insane madness!!!.

(rt.click and choose 'view in new tab' to see a larger image).

(Turbocharger re-mapping was dine improperly) ...
== The turbocharger needs to be re-mapped to prevent it from over-spooling, over-boosting a deleted engine. Without EGR gas, the engine needs FAR LESS BOOST pressure to make the same power, and anything over a set amount becomes harmful/damaging to an ISX real fast. Different model ISX's require different max boost because of different engine compression rations on them.

>> For CM870/871 engines, max boost should be 37-38lbs .. even when making far more HP than factory.

>> For CM2250 engines, max boost should be 35-36lbs .. even when making far more HP than factory.

>> For CM2350 engines, max boost should be 33-34lbs .. even when making far more HP than factory.

>> For CM2350-X15 engines, max boost should be 32-33lbs .. even when making far more HP than factory.

== IN YOUR PROGRAM HOWEVER, someone has made the turbo extremely lazy for whatever unknown reason. It looks like they did not know how to properly set the turbo, so they just set it to a flat value across the board like a blind fool. It certainly is not set correctly at all.


== All in all, it is clear that whoever made this program had no absolute clue what they were doing at all, but rather just got the check engine lights to go away and added a bunch of garbage to it to make up for the fact that it would not run eight.,. adding insult to injury on it, to make it 'feel' like it ran ok again. This points heavily towards whoever made this program initially, really does not care about other people's engines at all. Looks just like some garbage that was hobbled together simply for the quick and dirty $$$, and could care less about anything else.

Welcome to the bad delete club.

[Rawze]

Here is what needs to happen next...
ref: http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...2#pid68742

[mattdm]

(07-17-2023 )Rawze Wrote:  Here is what needs to happen next...
ref: http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...2#pid68742

Thank you so much. I figured things were a miss.

This truck is a 2013 registration, but production was 2012. Serial numbers match Vin according to quickserve.

What are your thoughts on a clean calibration with the Africa_G overlay?

[Rawze]

(07-17-2023 )mattdm Wrote:  

(07-17-2023 )Rawze Wrote:  Here is what needs to happen next...
ref: http://rawze.com/forums/showthread.php?t...2#pid68742

Thank you so much. I figured things were a miss.

This truck is a 2013 registration, but production was 2012. Serial numbers match Vin according to quickserve.

What are your thoughts on a clean calibration with the Africa_G overlay?

If your trying to do things by yourself, you could definitely use the official Africa-'J' overlay for the 2250's, and not the outdated G version. You will also need to adjust your boost tables according to the make/model truck you have. It does work well, but it is not how I do things when someone sends me a file to fix up for them. Africa-'J' is very reliable, safe, and stable when done right. many people do use it. Personally however, I do not use it. I am not a fan of using blocked faults to make things go away, but rather would shut things in the system off properly and be more thorough with everything.

[mattdm]

(07-17-2023 )Rawze Wrote:  If your trying to do things by yourself, you could definitely use the official Africa-'J' overlay for the 2250's, and not the outdated G version. You will also need to adjust your boost tables according to the make/model truck you have. It does work well, but it is not how I do things when someone sends me a file to fix up for them. Africa-'J' is very reliable, safe, and stable when done right. many people do use it. Personally however, I do not use it. I am not a fan of using blocked faults to make things go away, but rather would shut things in the system off properly and be more thorough with everything.

Would you be willing to fix up a stock calibration for me? Ill flash it and run it for 10 minutes and then pull it back off.

I was exploring the calibration files last night and found the Access sheet that breaks down each calibration along with its power levels. Is it safe to use the 600hp file on this motor for slightly more power?

Original File was based on CL10114, From my research CL10105 would be the factory 600hp Tune for this motor.

[Rawze]

(07-17-2023 )mattdm Wrote:  ...
Would you be willing to fix up a stock calibration for me? Ill flash it and run it for 10 minutes and then pull it back off.

I was exploring the calibration files last night and found the Access sheet that breaks down each calibration along with its power levels. Is it safe to use the 600hp file on this motor for slightly more power?

Original File was based on CL10114, From my research CL10105 would be the factory 600hp Tune for this motor.

I would recommend the 1850 original factory CL10114 file.

It should be noted that going from 1850 trq to 2050 trq, on average, results in about 150-200k overall shorter engine life regardless of demandating it or not ... depends also on how hard it is driven / the lifetime fuel mileage. Some people cannot afford to have their engine inframed at 650k instead of at 800k. This is because all the added torque (on all ISX 2050 programs) is only in the bottom end, below 1400 RPM, where it hurts the engine the most. The HP does not bother them (within reason), so much as the torque does.

As far as sending me the cleaned file off the engine, that is what most people end up doing once they are able to copy it into/out for themselves. I can only assume that they live somewhere where that kind of thing it is safe to do such things to their own equipment. I take no responsibility for that part of it.